The Tribune, Chandigarh, India

on record
‘Will be ready for Char Dham Yatra in time’
Harish Rawat, Chief Minister of Uttarakhand, speaks to Raj Chengappa and SMA Kazmi

What has been your experience in the first month of running the Uttarakhand Government?

The situation under which I took over was not normal, and there is a lot of work to be done. In Delhi [Centre], working is smooth and within given parameters. Here you have to think, plan and execute — everything is the Chief Minister’s responsibility.

What are the challenges in restarting the Char Dham Yatra?

First is the connectivity, then the rehabilitation of the local people affected — taxis, roads, dhabas, palanquins, purohits, shopkeepers. Without rehabilitating all of this we cannot expect to restart the Yatra. Restoring connectivity to Kedarnath by the 24 km track is also very difficult. The area is still under snow.

What are your priorities?

First we have to build confidence among people, which will come only when we have helped them restart their trades and businesses, even restore their houses. For that we are giving them money based on assessment by them. For shops people are being provided loans up to Rs 50 lakh under the Vir Chandra Singh Garhwali Yojna. Half of the interest amount will be subsidised. For the rest there will be no interest for the first two years, and during the subsequent two years it will be 4 per cent.

"Regulation will now be done through registration, without causing any harassment to the pilgrim. We will use the latest information technologies."
"In the hills the strategy has to be to make small improvements and not dramatic change in people’s income. Currently there is a downtrend trend. I have to stop that. Once people realise agriculture in the hills can also be beneficial, they will come forward."
"Larger industry does help the overall economy, but to remove disparity in income, we have to promote self-employment. So this year I am going to provide more through the supplementary budget for small and medium industry."
"Dams are a necessity, but not big dams. While Tehri Dam has given a lot to the nation, it has also created a lot of problems for the state. We have yet to solve the problem of rehabilitation of the affected people. I have suggested we store water wherever possible, because our strength is water, trees, forests and the youth."

Half of the Kedarnath track up to Rambara is being constructed by the local PWD. For the part from Rambara to Kedarnath we have constituted a task force headed by a DIG rank official, along with a colonel from the Mountaineering Institute, Uttarkashi. We will build three camps for pilgrims because they can’t stay at Kedarnath. We are developing three or four big sites for this. I expect everything to be done by April 20. We will invite people to come and see if the area is now safe, because we have to restore their confidence.

Have you used the opportunity to address some of the manmade problems, such as illegal construction and lack of planning?

Right now our focus is on reopening the route. Other issues will be addressed subsequently. We have to study the rivers Mandakini and Saraswati. The hills surrounding Kedarnath have to be stabilised. We will use the latest techniques available, for which research is already on. Experts from various fields will decide the course of action. The debris will have to be removed without posing a threat to the historical temple. It will be done in phases.

Have all bodies been removed from the site?

Nobody can really tell how many bodies may still be there. That will be known only after the layers of debris have been cleared. But compensation has been paid to all those who lost their family members.

Are sufficient funds available from the Centre?

The Central government has provided us enough. Help has also come under the NDRF provisions, as well as from other countries. Based on proposals prepared by us, the Central government has assured us it will provide Rs 7,500 crore. This year we will get more than Rs 1,000 crore, the next year it will be double that. This is for reconstruction and water schemes, etc. Part of this money is coming from the World Bank and ADB.

Then the BRO is reconstructing the roads connecting Kedarnath, Badrinath, Gangotri and Yamnotri, as well as Kailash Mansarovar and Hemkund Sahib. We are hopeful that we will be able to open Yamnotri and Gangotri before schedule. Kailash Mansarovar will be tough because of the long track that has been washed away.

We have till June to open the Kailash Mansarovar Yatra, but for the Char Dham there is only one month and 15 days. For the last few days I have not been able to sleep because of the bad weather. A day’s rain means a day of work lost.

How are you going to regulate the pilgrim flow now?

Regulation will now be done through registration, without causing any harassment to the pilgrim. We will use the latest information technologies. During last year’s tragedy many lives were lost because of lack of communication. Most outsiders don’t know the geography of the area. We will now provide people handsets on which they can just press a button in case there is some problem, and help will reach them. We have engaged BSNL for that. The Central Water Commission is also going to install a mechanism for flood warning. There will be a police post at the Chorabari lake, the bursting of which had caused the tragedy.

How are you reorganising disaster management in Uttarakhand?

The NDRF is going to station one battalion at Haridwar. We are also training a few battalions of the State Disaster Rescue Force. Then there will be a corps of local volunteers who know the topography of the area. We have a blueprint, which is already being implemented.

What are the big lessons that you learnt from the disaster?

Nature has a very delicate balance, and we have been casual in handling that. A lot has happened in the Himalayan region that should have been avoided. With their biodiversity and forest cover, the Himalayas provide oxygen and water to the entire North. The country should realise this and help build the economy of the region, but they have left us to fend for ourselves.

Constructing a road in Pithoragarh or Chamoli is a very costly affair, as it requires stabilising of the slopes, which is often neglected. Also ropeways can be put up to avoid building roads to every village. We could even consider relocating some villages, instead of cutting the hills to build roads to them. But the state has no money to do all this.

Are you going to ask for relaxation in rules governing mining?

It is not a question of relaxation. The Ministry of Environment and Forests as well as the Supreme Court have to understand that they have to trust the state government. They may advise the state on protecting the ecology while doing any development, but they should not totally ban all activity. What can a state that has 70 per cent of its land under forests do? We are just told don’t do this, don’t do that. Instead they should help us do things the right way.

Are you going to appeal against this order?

Yes. My predecessor as well as chief ministers before him had also taken up the matter with the Centre earlier. The state Assembly had also passed a resolution in this regard.

Besides the Char Dham Yatra, what are the other major issues facing you as Chief Minister?

Human resource development is important because a small hill state like ours has very few job opportunities. We hardly have any handicraft that may give employment. We do have a good base of education, but quality education remains a challenge. We need to have technical education, which I have started addressing. We have selected four engineering colleges and two polytechnics to develop as centres of excellence. Then I am going to put 12-13 ITIs also in that mode.

The next priority will be to reorganise agriculture. Farmers in the plain areas have to shift from traditional crops to a mix of things like floriculture, aquaculture, vegetables, etc. We will develop vegetable clusters as well as dairying. This will require infrastructure development.

In the hills, I will advise traditional crops, which can withstand the extreme climate. We will promote ragi (millet) cultivation. To provide a market for that, we will encourage beer manufacturers to establish units in the state, which will consume the produce. Bringing sophisticated food processing industry will be difficult, so we will start with small ventures.

Currently we are working on meadow development. We have big grazing grounds that will be developed. We will distribute fodder trees free of cost and will reward people who protect them for four or five years. This will help rear cattle for milk.

What about horticulture?

We are promoting hardy fruit trees, such as large lemon. We will also go for walnut instead of apple. We are distributing 100 to 200 walnut trees in every village for demonstration. Land consolidation is a major problem in Uttarakhand. We are going to select one village in each block for consolidation, for which Rs 1 crore will be spent per village.

We have a Mukhya Mantri Gram Suraksha Deewar Yojna, under which fencing will be done in villages by the Forest Department. In the hills the strategy has to be to make small improvements and not dramatic change in people’s income. Currently there is a downtrend. I have to stop that. Himachal Pradesh and J&K made changes long ago, we are only making a start yet. Once people realise agriculture in the hills can also be beneficial, they will come forward.

What are you planning for industry?

My effort will be to bring in new technologies in occupations like wood carving, weaving, or basket making.

Are you also trying to bring in larger industries?

I want people to be self-employed. If they go to a factory or any other place, they are working for somebody else. Larger industry does help the overall economy, but to remove disparity in income, we have to promote self-employment. So this year I am going to provide more through the supplementary budget for small and medium industry. Large industrial units often hire cheap labour from the market, and ignore the local population. My idea is to give the least land or electricity and create the maximum employment.

How will you improve your power situation? How is it currently?

Though two or three power plants are coming up very fast, there is a big gap between demand and supply. To improve the power situation, I will have to take certain hard and unpopular decisions.

How do you see the controversy over building dams in Uttarakhand?

Dams are a necessity, but not big dams. While Tehri Dam has given a lot to the nation, it has also created a lot of problems for the state. We have yet to solve the problem of rehabilitation of the affected people. As they say, Tehri saved Haridwar and Rishikesh from getting washed away in the floods last year, yet I want to build only smaller dams. I have suggested we store water wherever possible, because our strength is water, trees, forests and the youth.

So are you promoting micro-hydel projects?

Such projects will come to us if there is water in our rivers, which are currently drying up. Each village is being encouraged to have water harvesting bodies. If we store even one-fourth of the water that gets drained through the rivers, a lot of devastation would be prevented besides promoting agriculture. We have made a small beginning in this regard in this budget.

What will happen to the construction of big dams that has been stopped?

This is an issue being debated the world over. But in Uttarakhand, we have limited land. If you build big dams, where will the people go? As for the stopping of the ongoing projects, if they compensate us for the potential income lost we would have no problem. These are the only resources we have.

What is your assessment on the chances of the Congress in the Lok Sabha elections?

Being in government [at the Centre] for 10 years, we may have to face tough questions in the initial phase of elections, but then people will realise that the alternatives to the Congress are untested. And those that were tested earlier had failed miserably. That happened in 1977 and 1989, when people hoped to bring about change. But things only became worse. People then brought the Congress back to power, and the economy came on track. One experiment happened again with a non-Congress government, but the Congress had to be brought back.

Today people have attained a certain level of affluence, which they would not like to lose. They want an even better life than they have. And Modi is not going to be able to give them that.

What do you feel about Modi’s performance?

He has not been able to give people any vision. I have made a simple promise to my people. I will increase their earning from Rs 5,000 per month to Rs 6,000. People will judge me against that. But Modi is promising to change everything with a magic wand. His claim of development is also being exposed. Ports, refineries, airports and highways in Gujarat are not his creation. In social indicators, Gujarat is as low as the 18th, 14th or 13th place in various fields. He is only good at marketing what is already good. He has no vision for the 20 crore poor in the country.

What is your assessment for the Congress on the five seats in Uttarakhand?

We are clearly ahead on two seats, Haridwar and Tehri. In Almora we are marginally ahead, while Nainital and Pauri it will be a neck-to-neck fight.

Are your wife and son also aspirants for the party ticket?

No, they are not. They are just campaigning. It is only some people spreading rumours. In fact, I would prefer local people to reach an agreement on candidates.

When you formed your Cabinet last month, there was some dissension. How are you managing that?

We have many capable people, and I have not been able to honour some of them according to their merit. Yet, everybody is better placed than earlier. All have been given more than they had earlier. I clubbed certain departments with similar responsibilities — such as agriculture, horticulture and marketing — which was not liked by those who lost some charge in the process.

You have a thin majority. How do you plan to control infighting in the Congress?

There is no infighting in state unit of the party. Being a small state, any minor incident is exaggerated. Such matters are not even noticed in Lucknow. What is at stake for me is at stake for everyone.

Where do you plan to contest from for the Assembly?

I have a plan, let the time for that come.

Will you have to resign if you win only one seat in Uttarakhand?

People like me are made of different stuff. When I lost the election in 1991, I started working the very next day. I will only be a tougher competitor if I lose. But that situation will not arise, as I am confident we will win at least four seats. The BJP is not as well placed as it seemed earlier. Also the people of Uttarakhand would not like to have instability.