10,000 transfers don’t mean cops are tainted, it was a regular administrative exercise: Punjab DGP Gaurav Yadav

In conversation with The Tribune Editor-in-Chief Jyoti Malhotra and Deputy Editor Jupinderjit Singh on the ‘Decode Punjab’ show, Punjab Director-General of Police Gaurav Yadav aggressively defends the force against the drug taint charge. “No one can cast aspersions on the force,” he said.

Excerpts from the interview:

Q: Chief Minister Bhagwant Mann has transferred 10,000 cops after The Tribune reported the death of 14 persons due to drug abuse. What’s your response to that?

A: I would like to clarify and put it on record that Punjab Police is a very brave police force, which has successfully fought terrorism. I am proud of this police force. No one can cast aspersions on the force. And I would like to clarify, put it on record, that in this general reshuffle, there is no taint on anyone. There is a state policy on transfers, which was formulated in 2020. According to that, tenures of officers are prescribed. I am saying with complete authority. You cannot label a person as tainted until you have given him an opportunity. And this exercise has been carried out on administrative grounds.

So, it is a general administrative exercise. And I would suggest, yes, we are very conscious and very alive to drug trafficking.

At the same time, I would like to just tell you that the drug crescent is in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Afghan border. Ninety per cent of the world’s heroin is manufactured in Pakistan. It crosses this border to Punjab.

Q: How does it cross it?

A: Through drones. You see, we are fighting the nation’s battle. Pakistan is trying to bleed us cut by cut. Since 2019, 906 drones have crossed this border. Now, we, Punjab Police, in coordination with the Central Government, in coordination with the BSF, this year 101 out of the 247 drones were brought down. This is a war.

This is narco-terrorism sponsored by Pakistan, by state actors, by non-state actors. We are a border state. We have risen to the challenge. I would like to inform everyone, out of 68,000 NDPS Act cases registered in the country 12,000 to 13,000 are registered in Punjab every year. Our recovery rate is the highest. I would like to go and record and inform that during the model code of conduct from 16th of March to 1st of June, our recovery was the third highest in the country.

It is this Punjab Police which has done record recoveries. Our conviction rate at 81% under the NDPS Act is the highest in the country. It was 59% in 2017-18. So, from 59%, we have brought up the conviction rate. We have gone after the big fish. We have seized property worth Rs 200 crores of drug smugglers in the last two years alone. Earlier, it was zero. This, again, is among the highest figures in the country.

I am passionate about my police force. Absolutely. Their honour, the honour of a constable of the Punjab Police is important to me.

We are sitting in a state which has international borders. Every day, we are facing national security challenges. So, the police force is performing.

The police force has delivered. Yes, there would be black sheep in the police. And we have a zero tolerance policy to, you know… somebody who’s connived, who’s involved in the drug trade.

And also, we have dismissed our people, taken criminal action. We have registered FIRs, arrested police officers.

But please don’t cast aspersions on Punjab Police. It’s a brave police force, which is fighting the nation’s battle.

Q: So, are you saying that the political party in power, the Aam Aadmi Party, which has…

A: We are professionals. We don’t comment on political matters. Please confine yourself to propositional questions.

Q: There is one police officer who’s still absconding. Punjab Police carries out CASOs, the Cordon and Search Operations, I think every two weeks. But AIG Raj Jit Singh has been absconding for more than one year…

A: Since it’s (this case) being monitored by the court, I cannot comment on investigations. But you see, we have confiscated his property worth nearly 20 crores. Nilabh Kishore, one of the finest officers in the country and who investigated the Arushi murder case, is in charge of this case. He is making all efforts to go forward with this. We are very hopeful.

Q: You talked about the big fish. Who are the big fish?

A: We define big fish as anybody from whom 2 kg or a bigger seizure of heroin is made. Small fish is like 10 grams, 100 grams… We don’t go after the consumers. We have a positive approach towards the consumers. Now, drugs are available as there are a large number of peddlers because of unemployment, in fact, I would commend The Tribune for highlighting this story. But a very interesting thing is, whenever there’s a crackdown on enforcement, with the enforcement, overdose deaths increase. So, they’re not technically overdose deaths because when we have analysed, most of them are spurious drugs. What happens is that we drive the drugs off the market. There’s a lot of pressure. We make arrests. We make recoveries. So, either the drug becomes costlier or the drug is not available. Then what happens is diversions. In fact, that is normally happening in South Malwa… people are taking to pharmaceutical drugs in a big way. Because certain other drugs are not available. So, that is why we always say that a multi-pronged approach is required.

And I would say that police alone cannot fight the problem of drug trafficking. It has to be the other sectors of the government, the state government, the Central Government who have to chip in. And the society at large, people have to…

Q: So, that multi-pronged approach is not happening?

A: It is happening.

Q: You said these drones are dropping drugs from Pakistan… We have heard that a third of the houses in border villages have people who are addicts.

A: I would agree the problem is acute in the border areas. What we have done is, two years back we sat with the various agencies and formulated a plan especially for the border. So, along with the BSF, we put our naka points five kilometres to seven kilometres behind the BSF. We took Central agencies on board. We found out the hotspots where the drones were coming. We mapped the hotspots…

Q: So, which are the hotspots?

A: I cannot comment much on the details. The general picture is, primarily, these hotspots are in Tarn Taran and Amritsar districts. We have got Rs 40 crore to have infrastructure on the second line of defence. Now, half of that, 20 crore, we are spending to put 3,200 CCTVs at various locations because we, the police, can’t be everywhere. The Housing Corporation is installing the CCTVs, cameras. Ten crore we spent on increasing the mobility of the border police stations by getting them additional vehicles, newer vehicles.

Q: So, these drones fly over the border and then how does it work? You shoot them down and then you find these packets of heroin?

A: Again, it’s confidential territory. Sometimes, they just drop the load. We come to know because, again, what we have done, we have formed village defence committees all along the border. First, we started within 5 kilometres of the border. Now, we have extended to 10 kilometres of the border. A lot of people, especially in the districts of Pathankot, Gurdaspur, they are ex-servicemen. So, we are getting a lot of support from the common people also. They tell us, they inform us. And what is basically happening is that we have certain people, certain families who say that they’ve been into this for generations… on the other side of the border, on this side of the border also.

Q: In it for generations? Meaning?

A: Meaning over the last 70-80 years, smuggling has been going on across this border.

Q: What is smuggled?

A: It started with, I would remember, when the border used to be unfenced. There used to be a lot of intrusions in the 90s, 80s. When the fence came up, it was a gamechanger. Now, there are certain gaps in the fencing because the Ravi washes it away. Then, these drones started in 2019.

Q: So, drones are only five years old?

A: It was 20th September, 2019, when the first drone was found.

Q: What was it carrying?

A: Drugs, explosives. Earlier, there would be specific modules. They would only send explosives. Then, majorly, they sent drugs. But now, we are seeing mixed consignments. A typical consignment might have drugs, might have a few pistols, also.

Q: How big is an average consignment?

A: It depends. In fact, because we have made it difficult for them, till last year, we used to have bigger drones. They would be carrying 10 to 12 kgs. Now hexacopter drones are coming, which are very, very small. They bring drugs between 0.5 kg to 1.5 kg.

Q: The Pakistan economy is in such a terrible shape, yet they’re sending drugs across the border into India…

A: To try and debilitate the population. It’s a way of making money. Maybe, they’re (Pakistanis) living off the drugs.

Q: This is another kind of a proxy war, would you say?

A: Yes, that’s what I said. They are trying to bleed India by a thousand cuts. Like they are waging a proxy war. They are using narco-terrorism. They’re using every trick in the trade. That’s why I said in the beginning that we are fighting the nation’s battle.

Q: There is a concerted effort by the Pakistanis, with the government, to carry on this campaign of narco-terrorism?

A: Definitely, because we have evidence of the involvement of ISI officials.

Q: Evidence? Can you tell us a little bit about it? What kind of evidence?

A: It is encouraging drug trade in Punjab. It is the main state actor behind all this. The Pakistan ISI is the main actor behind narco-terrorism in India.

Q: Chief Minister Bhagwant Mann said the other day that a lot of the drugs were coming from Gujarat and Maharashtra.

A: Yes, drugs are coming from the hinterland also, various states. What we call bhukki (Poppy husk) and all, which is consumed in the Malwa region of Punjab. Nothing (no drug) is grown in Punjab, so, there are no licences… There are opium cultivation licences in UP, MP and Rajasthan.

Licit opium is cultivated for medicinal purposes and then it is diverted. So, traditionally, poppy husk and opium have been coming from Haryana, Rajasthan side. The charas comes from Himachal. What has happened is that shipments have been coming (from Gujarat too). Last year, we got 75 kgs of heroin. It was a joint operation with the Gujarat ATS. One was from Mumbai.

Q: Where are they coming from? Pakistan?

A: Not Pakistan directly. They are from Middle East countries. But Pakistan is definitely the prime mover.

Q: The epicentre, would you say?

A: Yes. Pakistan is the epicentre of narco-terrorism and it’s aimed at India. Yes.

Q: So, the Punjab Police and the BSF are working and collaborating, especially along the border. You have full support from the Centre?

A: Yes. Punjab Government has full support of the Central Government. We are professionals and in matters of national security, we always work together. And again, Punjab has had a history. That is how terrorism in Punjab was defeated, by the joint efforts of everyone.

Q: Do you believe you need other parts of the government to also come and work with you?

A: I fully agree. In fact, that is why we had flagged this issue. And the chief secretary yesterday had held a meeting with all the administrative secretaries. And we discussed a sort of a blueprint on how to take this forward by, first of all, the health department. Now, they are building up a plan to sort of bolster their capacity for de-addiction, their capacity for then linking it with skill development, looking for funding from Central Government, in education and in sports.

Q: So, the state government would be preparing an overall comprehensive plan. But is this the first time that’s being done? That would be quite strange, wouldn’t it?

A: You see, as I said, from the enforcement point of view, what happens is that you catch a lot of people, you put them behind the bars, including the big fish.

Q: And they’re behind bars?

A: Yes, yes. Our 81% conviction rate in NDPS cases is the highest in the country. We have had seizures of 48 kg, 36 kg, 70 kg.

Q: So, in the last six months, how much of drugs would you have picked up?

A: Last year, our heroin recovery was 1,350 kg. Just for perspective, in 2017, our heroin recovery was 170 kg. It has gone up by 560%. This year, I think we are touching around 500. After brainstorming, we are also focusing majorly on what we call points of sale. These are the places in mohallas and villages where drugs are being sold.

Q: Is this the first time that the Punjab Government is undertaking this comprehensive exercise?

A: I think in the past also, exercises must have been done.

Q: And nothing happened.

A: No, things do happen. Because what I feel, that it is a national challenge in the sense that you have a country whose major objective is to destabilise India.

Q: Heroin recovery has increased from 179 kg to 1,346 kg. How much percentage would this be compared to the actual consumption?

A: Yes, that is the question. I fully agree. That is what I tell my officers… Don’t be complacent just because you’re making large recoveries. Do we just want to know how much is total heroin consumed in Punjab daily? I would not speculate on this. I’ll tell you why. A lot of it is spurious… This is backed by scientific analysis, because when we investigate the drug deaths (because in all cases, we are registering culpable homicide cases), when we investigate, most of the drugs found are spurious. They mix something with the other. So, obviously, it is not… That is why a death occurs.

But it is very unfortunate that a lot of them are turning to other addictions. Like, as we discussed in this meeting of the chief secretary, Tramadol. Tramadol is widely prevalent. This is what one of our experienced officers said. He said, ‘We are going in for a major crackdown now. Be prepared for increase in overdose deaths, because heroin is going to get scarcer. The price is going to go up.’

Q: One of the main demands made by politicians — including elected members, including Aam Aadmi Party (AAP) leaders — was that Punjab should have opium cultivation.

A: I don’t know. You see, in the US also, marijuana has been decriminalised. I’m not an expert on narcotic matters.

Q: Let’s talk about something else. Amritpal, the Member of Parliament from Khadoor Sahib, is in jail under NSA.

A: I cannot make any comments in the matter because it is a quasi-judicial matter. It is beyond my purview.

Q: I think the conduct of the Punjab Police during the recent elections was quite remarkable. Because although the BJP candidates did complain that a lot of the farmers did not let them enter the villages, but you were able to avert confrontations, you were able to get people to talk to each other.

A: Not a single violent incident took place in Punjab. We were commended by everyone. All parties campaigned freely. And given the internal security challenges, given the threat from across the border, given the intelligence inputs over the elections, Punjab Police rose to the occasion and conducted the elections in a very flawless and smooth way.